Response: “Commentary: Is the moon there if nobody looks? Bell inequalities and physical reality”
- 1Mathematical Institute, Leiden University, Leiden, Netherlands
- 2Facultad de Ciencias Exactas y Naturales, Ruta Mcal. J. F. Estigarribia, , San Lorenzo, Paraguay
A Commentary on
Is the moon there if nobody looks—Bell inequalities and physical reality
by Gill R. D. and Lambare J. P. (2020). Front. Phys. 10:00273. doi: 10.3389/fphy.2020.00273
1 Introduction
Marian Kupczynski (“MK”) is the author of a controversial paper published (2020) in the journal Frontiers in Physics [1]. The work is built around a mathematical claim by MK which is actually false, and MK’s reasoning around this claimed assertion is also false. The proof of that is the main content of our present “Comment”. It is merely a mathematical counter-example to a mathematical claim in [1].
2 Bell’s inequalities do hold for Kupzcynski’s model
Kupczynki [1] incorporates hidden variables, standing for random disturbances arising in the measurement apparatus and dependent on the local measurement setting, as follows. Consider an experiment in which Alice and Bob’s settings will be x and y. To begin with, hidden variables (λ1, λ2) with some arbitrary joint probability mass function p(λ1, λ2), not depending on the local settings x and y chosen by the experimenters, are transmitted from the source to the two measurement stations. At Alice’s station and Bob’s station, independently of one another, and independently of (λ1, λ2), local hidden variables λx and λy are created with probability mass functions px(λx) and py(λy). The measurement outcome on Alice’s side is then Ax(λ1, λx), and similarly on Bob’s side, By(λ1, λy). The functions Ax and By depend in any way whatever on x and y respectively; even the domains of these functions can vary. The sets of possible outcomes of λx and λy may depend on x and y respectively. Now repeat this story with, instead of x, y, settings x, y′, then x′, y, then x′, y′. In this way, Kupczynski has defined the four expectation values E(AxBy), E(Ax′By), E(AxBy′), E(Ax′By′) of interest, on four “dedicated” hidden variable spaces, which he moreover states are “disjoint”. Therefore, he is unable to define certain “counterfactual” expectations which are used in his proof in the non-contextual case of the Bell-CHSH inequalities. Does this mean that the inequalities need not hold? His argument that they could be violated is based on the huge number of free parameters which his model allows. However, he does not actually specify any particular instantiation of all those parameters which does the job. He does claim that other authors did already do just that.
MK says about his framework: “counterfactual expectations E(AxAx′), E(ByBy′), E(AxAx′ByBy′) do not exist and Bell and CHSH inequalities may not be derived”. He hereby refers to the usual CHSH inequalities for the four expectations E(AxBy), E(AxBy′), E(Ax′By), E(Ax′By′). The context is a Bell-type experiment in which Alice chooses between settings x and x′, and Bob chooses between settings y and y′. MK talks about four different Kolmogorov probability models for the four sub-experiments (one setting choice for Alice and one for Bob). Here are his expressions for the four expectation values of interest, where we have amplified his already long formulas by inserting part of the definition of the four underlying sample spaces Λxy, Λxy′, Λx′y, Λx′y′.
These four equations are a complicated way to say the following: with settings x, y, hidden variables (λ1, λ2) with some arbitrary joint probability mass function p(λ1, λ2) (independent of x and y) are transmitted from the source to the two measurement stations. At Alice’s station and Bob’s station, independently of one another, local hidden variables λx and λy are created with probability mass functions px(λx) and py(λy). The measurement outcome on Alice’s side is Ax(λ1, λx), and similarly on Bob’s side, By(λ1, λy). Now repeat this story with, instead of x, y, settings x, y′, then x′, y, then x′, y′. Kupczynski has defined these expectation values on four “dedicated” hidden variable spaces, which he moreover states are “disjoint”. Therefore, he says, he is unable to defined certain “counterfactual” expectations which his proof in the non-contextual case used, and hence he can’t derive Bell and CHSH inequalities.
But we can do all that! And we can even use his original proof in the non-contextual case to get those inequalities! Here is just one of many ways.
Take as sample space a set of tuples λ = (λ1, λ2, λx, λx′, λy, λy′). This space is just the Cartesian product of the spaces whose existence Kupczynski already hypothesized. Take as probability mass function on this space the product p(λ1, λ2)px(λx)px′(λx′)py(λy)py′(λy′). Finally, define new measurement functions A(λ, x) = Ax(λ1, λx), B(λ, y) = By(λ2, λy) where x can be replaced by x′ and/or y by y′. Now compute E(AxBy), also with x replaced by x′ and/or y by y′. It is immediately clear that the four new expectation values of products have exactly the same values as those just exhibited of Kupczynski’s. We can now go back to Kupczynski’s own earlier traditional derivation of Bell-CHSH. There is no barrier to running through the usual proof since all four expectations of products are defined on the same probability space.
There are more efficient constructions. As one learns in courses on Monte Carlo simulation, one can define a discrete random variable with an arbitrary probability distribution as a function of a single uniformly distributed random variable on the unit interval [0, 1]. Thus one could define λx and
3 Discussion
We have proved that MK’s claim that his hidden variables model does not allow Bell’s inequalities to be derived is a false mathematical statement. Furthermore, Mk’s paper also contains an obvious contradiction when he inadvertently validates Bell’s model stating that “Although the expectations calculated using Equations (11–14) and (19–22) have the same values, the two sets of formulas describe different experiments”. Since both systems of equations “have the same values”, MK’s hidden variables model also satisfies the Bell inequality.
Kupcynski’s blunder arises from a literal interpretation of different equivalent mathematical expressions, one of which has a direct physical meaning, while the other, obtained after correct mathematical transformations, does not. Curiously, such confusion, which first appeared in 1972 [2], persists to this day [3]. References [4, 5] explain similar inconsistencies arising from joint probabilities and incompatibility.
Also his criticism of past “loophople-free” Bell experiments is unduly harsh and he seems unaware of methodology already in use which minimalises the problem of apparent violation of “no-signalling”. A more detailed explanation can be found in a longer and earlier version of this paper available on arXiv.org [6].
Data availability statement
The original contributions presented in the study are included in the article/supplementary material, further inquiries can be directed to the corresponding author.
Author contributions
RG initiated this project and wrote an initial draft which he shared with JP. Discussions led to many changes that resulted on a preprint [6]. We decided to summarise our findings in a short “Comment” in Frontiers in Physics. In the meantime, MK published a response [7] to our preprint [6] and a debate ensued on PubPeer.org.
Acknowledgments
RDG is grateful for numerous discussions with Marian Kupczynski on his work.
Conflict of interest
The authors declare that the research was conducted in the absence of any commercial or financial relationships that could be construed as a potential conflict of interest.
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References
1. Kupczynski M. Is the moon there if nobody looks: Bell inequalities and physical reality. Front Phys (2020) 8:13. doi:10.3389/fphy.2020.00273
2. de la Peña L, Cetto AM, Brody TA. On hidden-variable theories and Bell’s inequality. Lett Nuovo Cimento (1972) 5:177–81. doi:10.1007/BF02815921
3. Lambare JP. On the relevance of Bell’s probabilistic model for spin correlations. Quan Stud : Math Found (2022) 9:211–7. doi:10.1007/s40509-021-00265-7
4. Lambare JP, Franco R. A note on Bell’s theorem logical consistency. Found Phys (2021) 51:84. doi:10.1007/s10701-021-00488-z
5. Lambare JP. Comment on “Nonlocality claims are inconsistent with Hilbert-space quantum mechanics”. Phys Rev A (Coll Park) (2021) 104:066201. doi:10.1103/PhysRevA.104.066201
6.Kupczynski’s contextual setting-dependent parameters offer no escape from Bell-CHSH Richard D. Gill, Justo Pastor Lambare (2022), Available at: https://arxiv.org/abs/2208.09930.
7. Kupczynski M. Is the moon there if nobody looks: A reply to gill and lambare (2020), Available at: https://arXiv.org/abs/2209.07992.
Keywords: Bell’s theorem, local realism, quantum entanglement, contextuality, Bell-CHSH inequality
Citation: Gill RD and Lambare JP (2022) General commentary: Is the moon there if nobody looks—Bell inequalities and physical reality. Front. Phys. 10:1024718. doi: 10.3389/fphy.2022.1024718
Received: 22 August 2022; Accepted: 21 November 2022;
Published: 09 December 2022.
Edited by:
Jonas Maziero, Federal University of Santa Maria, BrazilReviewed by:
Adam Bednorz, University of Warsaw, PolandJanne Kujala, University of Turku, Finland
Philippe Grangier, UMR8501 Laboratoire Charles Fabry (LCF), France
Copyright © 2022 Gill and Lambare. This is an open-access article distributed under the terms of the Creative Commons Attribution License (CC BY). The use, distribution or reproduction in other forums is permitted, provided the original author(s) and the copyright owner(s) are credited and that the original publication in this journal is cited, in accordance with accepted academic practice. No use, distribution or reproduction is permitted which does not comply with these terms.
*Correspondence: Richard D. Gill, gill@math.leidenuniv.nl